Dr. Foster Mobley: Leadership, Authenticity, and Lessons from Season One

After interviewing some of the most insightful leaders across industries, it’s time to turn the mic around. In this special episode of Step Wise, host Dr. Foster Mobley takes center stage as Jana Devan interviews him on the key lessons, themes, and personal takeaways from the first season.

Foster reflects on conversations with top executives and leadership thinkers, including Janet Foutty, Valorie Kondos Field, Kent Thiry, and Paul Viviano, about how leadership is evolving to be more human-centered, purpose-driven, and deeply connected to well-being. He also shares his own philosophy on leadership, coaching, and why the relationship between leaders and followers is more important than ever.

Join us for an inspiring look back at Season One, Foster’s personal leadership journey, and what’s next for Step Wise!

#FosterMobley #StepWisePodcast #Leadership #Authenticity #CEOCoaching #HumanCenteredLeadership

Hosted by Foster Mobley
Learn more about Foster at fostermobleymt.com or follow us on Instagram and LinkedIn at Foster Mobley.
www.instagram.com/fostermobley
https://www.linkedin.com/in/fostermobley/

Produced, Edited, and Promoted by Zettist

Additional support from Amber Jillard Consulting

Music for Season 3 composed and performed by Philip Aaberg. Courtesy of Sweetgrass Music.

Transcript

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00;00;06;21 - 00;00;31;08

Jana Devan

Welcome to Step wise. You might notice this voice sounds a little different today. And that's because today's interview is of Foster Mobley. So you are hearing the voice of Jana Davan. I'll be facilitating the interview today. But what I really want to talk about is this remark, a person that we're going to get to hear for the next 30 minutes.

00;00;31;10 - 00;01;02;26

Jana Devan

Doctor Foster Mobley, you have heard him ask questions to many different leaders about authenticity and growing in leadership. How to really show up as your full self at work. And he's someone who walks it like he talks it. He's a father, a business owner, student and an outdoorsman. And today we're going to talk about some of the lessons foster has learned along his journey of interviewing.

00;01;02;26 - 00;01;34;00

Jana Devan

Now over 50 people, but really focusing on these first ten and thinking about the lessons that have come up along the way, from Janet Foutty to Valerie Kondos Field to Kent Thiry. Foster has taken so much from these interviews, as we hope you have too. And so today we thought it would just be special to open up the floor, to foster and let you get to know him a little bit.

00;01;34;02 - 00;01;35;17

Jana Devan

So without further ado.

00;01;35;24 - 00;02;06;11

Dr. Foster Mobley

My name is Foster Mobley. I am the founder and chairman emeritus of a Human Capital Consulting and advisory firm called FMcG leading. Founded in 1984. Been added a while. Have a wonderful and inspiring cohort of colleagues across the country. We're about 80% of our work is in health care. My focus in my 45 years in practice has been on kind of the duality of leadership, culture and business strategy.

00;02;06;16 - 00;02;32;08

Dr. Foster Mobley

So my job is as a CEO, coach, CEO whisperer to help advise them on not the strategic moves necessarily, but how they need to lead them, because behavior without the context of strategy, like why are we doing it, isn't useful. I live in Bozeman, Montana. My wife, Cathy of 34 years is also a leadership coach and, have three kids and a bunch of wonderful grandkids.

00;02;32;08 - 00;02;35;14

Dr. Foster Mobley

And we're getting ready to celebrate the holidays with with one of them.

00;02;35;22 - 00;02;58;03

Jana Devan

I know across the season, we've talked to a lot of people across all different sectors, and many of them we're talking about how leadership is evolving to be more human centered. How does that reaffirm or challenge what you believe as you've coached for all these years?

00;02;58;04 - 00;03;23;25

Dr. Foster Mobley

They were good interviews, right? That was a lot of fun. That oh, boy. You know, it's funny. What a great country this is. I get paid to interview people and learn and get inspired all over again. Fantastic. The notion, that I approached them all with is, what is leadership like in this challenging time? And to the person they were talking about a my words, a different relationship between leader and follower.

00;03;23;28 - 00;03;51;16

Dr. Foster Mobley

The standard 1980 1990 textbook leaders inspire, leaders, create followers, and all that kind of stuff is important. It's necessary, but it's not sufficient. Sufficient. Today, according to them, is a sense of purpose and place where people can have more of a voice, where people have a chance to fulfill their full capability. And that's hard to do, and yet that's the right thing to do.

00;03;51;18 - 00;04;23;22

Dr. Foster Mobley

So it affirmed what I've known and believed and taught for many years about the importance, the primacy of the relationship between leader and follower. One of my mentors, the late Warren Bennis, said the relationship between leaders and followers is an intimate allyship. Leaders and followers are intimate allies, and I believe that to be true. And so what intimate allies means in today's world with multi generations, with more humanity being brought in, is being redefined as we go.

00;04;23;22 - 00;04;27;29

Dr. Foster Mobley

We don't even know it all yet, but we know it's different than what it used to be.

00;04;28;01 - 00;04;46;07

Jana Devan

Yeah. And you mentioned it's difficult to do. How how does that translate into coaching someone. How to do it. You know, you are helping CEOs learn how to do this thing that we can't even really put our finger on yet. So how does that work?

00;04;46;08 - 00;05;09;03

Dr. Foster Mobley

The catch phrase of FMcG leading is and has been for a while. We work at the intersection of humanity and high performance. One without the other would would be kind of half the battle. After these interviews and based on my own reading and research, I think about leading today at the intersections like a Venn diagram with three factors.

00;05;09;06 - 00;05;33;01

Dr. Foster Mobley

One is what is the leader need to do to lead him or herself to show up fully UN triggered, unencumbered, present being clear of biases that would shape a conversation or relationship in one way. I talked a lot about that in my first book, about having a clear stream. But what does the leader need to do in today's tumultuous world to show up fully?

00;05;33;01 - 00;05;58;29

Dr. Foster Mobley

So leading self, I call it honoring. What do we need to do to honor ourselves fully so that we can be full participants in our life. And leading the second circle, then, is honoring the other, and that is the relationship between leader and follower or two partners. The part power over paradigm is done and dead. There's enough research that says it doesn't work anymore in this complex world.

00;05;59;02 - 00;06;20;12

Dr. Foster Mobley

So what must I do as a leader to honor the other person? To create a partnership? To listen more deeply? To really, truly regard the other human being, whether I agree with all of what they say. This is not it's really funny because there's a lot of misnomers about honoring the other, like, oh gee, is this is the Gen Z that wants participation trophies?

00;06;20;13 - 00;06;52;21

Dr. Foster Mobley

No it's not. It's not. It is about how we can help each other live our full destinies. And then the third concentric circle is that of honoring the organization, because you and I can have a great love fest. We can have we we can have all these, quote, kumbaya moments and really have a great relationship. But if we don't honor the organization's needs for a performance in a particular low values, value centric way that the organization decides, we haven't fulfilled our full requirement.

00;06;52;23 - 00;07;16;21

Dr. Foster Mobley

And that means that organizations in today's world are undergoing change, disruption in ways that as a whole, we haven't seen. We really haven't seen. Just when we thought everything was cool. Then I comes along just before that global pandemic came along that, you know, shut everything down. And we really learned about virtual work and the digital revolution just before that.

00;07;16;21 - 00;07;44;03

Dr. Foster Mobley

And you can fill in your just before that. Meanwhile, we're dealing with four generations in the workplace, all of whom have very different perspectives and needs and stuff like that. So if we don't honor the needs of the organization to perform in a very tumultuous, disruptive time, we haven't really done it. So I think it is leading today, if you think about it, is three concentric circles showing up, fully leading, self honoring, self showing up fully for you, honoring you, helping you get the best.

00;07;44;05 - 00;08;03;09

Dr. Foster Mobley

Like doesn't that make sense that you perform at your highest and best and then leading up and honoring the needs of the organization? Any one of those three without the other two, it's an unfulfilled picture. And so for me, that's the kind of paradigm that's come out of all these interviews.

00;08;03;11 - 00;08;33;15

Jana Devan

Yeah. And I think one of the through lines of what everyone has talked about is this idea of balancing personal well-being with performance, which kind of aligns with these three concentric circles you're talking about. And, you know, trying to find balance between these things is a huge barrier for leaders right now. Do you have any advice on trying to achieve that in organizations?

00;08;33;17 - 00;08;50;08

Dr. Foster Mobley

Well, I'll take exception to one simple word and I don't know. And it's the word balance because I don't know what that means. There are times that I'm going to work 100 hours in a week, and it's going to fill me up. I'm going to be so jacked because I'm moving the ball down the field, and that's what needed to be done in the moment.

00;08;50;11 - 00;09;31;06

Dr. Foster Mobley

There are times where I'm where I'm not. I'm not that attentive. So it's really regarding or honoring or listening to being able to handle this dynamic need between those three forces self, other and organization. But there is no question, Janna, to the heart of your to the heart of your question. There is a greater sense that the workplace needs to be a catalyst in some part, maybe not all, but in some part to helping people fulfill their personal purpose and align their work with something of value that matters to them.

00;09;31;08 - 00;10;00;06

Dr. Foster Mobley

You know, trust in global institutions is at an all time low. Trust in churches. Trust in academia. Trust in government. All time low. And it was interesting because 20 years ago the trust in business organizations was low. But now maybe it's because of the virtual nature of some of it or hybrid natures. Now people are looking for that as a part of their community, and in that they get some of their personal needs fulfilled.

00;10;00;09 - 00;10;20;21

Dr. Foster Mobley

And so organizations would be wise to pay attention to that need for purpose and mission and helping people accomplish theirs to the extent they can. The fact and the other thing that got pointed out a lot in the interviews, these are free agents, the agency of employees or teammates or whatever we call them today has never been higher.

00;10;20;22 - 00;10;37;23

Dr. Foster Mobley

They can walk, they can and do walk. They can walk with their levels of engagement, but they could walk with their employment. They could become an influencer and make three times the amount of money that they make working on a job description and do it on the beach and have fun doing TikToks. How do we compete against that?

00;10;37;23 - 00;10;48;15

Dr. Foster Mobley

Unless we're helping create environments for people to truly, truly that matter to them, where they can really fulfill themselves deeply based on purpose and mission?

00;10;48;17 - 00;11;10;28

Jana Devan

It reminds me of what Jenna Fischer was talking about in your interview. You know, her position and learning with Deloitte that people need to be happy at work. Like it's such a simple thing, but we need to find ways to really get people engaged and make their cup full, or else they're not going to want to stay.

00;11;11;01 - 00;11;31;14

Dr. Foster Mobley

Yeah, I loved her point. Do people need to be happy at work? Well, what is the impact that work has on their happiness? Gee, if we could pay attention to that. Yeah. Being happy helps. Engagement helps all that kind of stuff. Now, simple, simplistically ask because I get to ask this a lot. Is my job as a supervisor to make everybody happy?

00;11;31;16 - 00;11;51;07

Dr. Foster Mobley

No. Your job as a supervisor is not to make everybody happy, but it's to honor that person's needs, and it's to honor the organization's needs. And let's find something in that balance. But it's not just to assign a task and say, peace out. Let me know in 30 days when you're done. Because people are looking for different levels of meaning and engagement with the people in their work.

00;11;51;10 - 00;12;20;04

Jana Devan

Yeah. And it seems like a lot of that would rely on self-reflection. And it was surprising through all of these interviews, you did these CEOs and and coaches all talking about how they spend time, deep time in self-reflection and really honor that part of themselves. And I'm curious if your own personal work has shaped your ability to lead and coach others.

00;12;20;05 - 00;12;44;04

Dr. Foster Mobley

Oh, without question. So I forgot who said it, but somebody said, if you don't have mindfulness practice set up by now for yourself, you're probably playing at a percentage of your full capabilities, because that gives us a chance to sit and reflect on our actions and the impact of our actions. Because the fact is, as leaders, I'm not paid for people taking action.

00;12;44;04 - 00;13;13;18

Dr. Foster Mobley

I'm paid for people getting results. I want to get the most effective way toward those results possible. Therefore, I take an action. I measure the impact. I see if it has a desired. If it doesn't, if I can reflect after the fact. Also in the moment. But if I can reflect after the fact and adjust myself based on self-knowledge and getting lots of feedback the next time around, a much more likely to get better impact, probably with fewer resources expended.

00;13;13;20 - 00;13;35;06

Dr. Foster Mobley

So mindfulness practices are really important. There was a quote I read this morning that said, we are expected to look at a pot of boiling water and get clarity, but it's only when the water before the water boils where it's still that we can see a real reflection, and only after the water boils, when it's still can we see the reflection.

00;13;35;08 - 00;13;57;27

Dr. Foster Mobley

So we're trying to get clarity from those things, but we're looking at the pot when it's boiling and and doing the best we can. And so those periods of stillness before and after, hopefully as a matter of life practice matter a whole lot. So yes, for me it's been huge. You know, my daughter Erin, who was, I think episode number 9 or 8 or something, who gave a phenomenal argument.

00;13;57;27 - 00;14;23;16

Dr. Foster Mobley

Why, if leaders aren't doing their own work now, they're lost. They just they don't have the same opportunity to stay ahead of or be part of this great tumult going on. But she started me on a process of reflection and journaling about two years ago, and it's been monumentally powerful because I know for one, I'm I'm a hard boiled, recovering MBA.

00;14;23;19 - 00;14;46;19

Dr. Foster Mobley

I think logically, I think at least I think it's logical. I think logically, and I don't always take the time to reflect. I process emotions slowly. I'm not one of the people that can figure out, well, now I'm feeling x, y, z takes me a bit to get to that. So a daily process of journaling and reflection helps me process, even if it's the day before.

00;14;46;25 - 00;15;03;29

Dr. Foster Mobley

I kind of tangle and I get clear and I went, oh yeah, that's what it was about. And I reacted this way. Next time, hopefully I can be present enough to react the following way, which is way better. So yeah, it's been it's been monumentally foundational for me.

00;15;04;01 - 00;15;24;18

Jana Devan

Yeah. It's hard to learn about yourself without reflecting on what you've done if you're just, you know, bulldozing through life without thinking about your actions. It would be incredibly hard to learn and lead in and have, you know, regard for others and regard for yourself.

00;15;24;20 - 00;15;41;21

Dr. Foster Mobley

Thank thank you. I in my coaching, I tell leaders, you don't need to do this stuff. You don't need to reflect. You only need to do it if you want to learn quickly. You know, if you want to learn quickly, then learn to reflect. The Army does it. They do these after action reviews so that they don't repeat the same thing again.

00;15;41;21 - 00;15;51;06

Dr. Foster Mobley

And they learn more rapidly. You only need to reflect if you're interested in learning, which of course, sarcastically almost everybody is. Almost everybody.

00;15;51;08 - 00;15;55;16

Jana Devan

Especially people like you who are the MBA, you know, logical thinking.

00;15;55;16 - 00;16;03;06

Dr. Foster Mobley

Oh boy, oh boy. I put on my I put on my finest blazer for you today because that's why I got my MBA suit on.

00;16;03;13 - 00;16;25;12

Jana Devan

Yes. Well, you know, you had really dove into the idea of authenticity in this season. And as you're thinking about your upcoming book. And so it was a recurring theme, and I'm just wondering, how has your idea of authenticity shifted or what does it mean to you?

00;16;25;14 - 00;16;50;01

Dr. Foster Mobley

What I learned from our initial, I don't know, ten or so plus interviews was it is authenticity within limits? It is. If you are moving your organization's goals and forward, and your goals for it, and you're speaking as a member of that organization, you know, rather than yourself, then it is great and important to speak your truth.

00;16;50;03 - 00;17;15;18

Dr. Foster Mobley

If it helps move the organization's goals forward and serves the organization's mission, if it is not, if it is something that is about you and not the organization as an organization leader, while it could be authentic to, you know, say, look, I had a crappy cup of coffee at Starbucks this morning and that barista and I'm going to get online because it's free speech and because I, I'm being authentic.

00;17;15;18 - 00;17;30;01

Dr. Foster Mobley

It really stunk. I didn't like, like, who is that serving? It's not serving anybody. And so again, authenticity within within or serving a purpose I think is what I learned about, for business leaders.

00;17;30;05 - 00;17;54;22

Jana Devan

I loved that conversation you had with Valerie about the students and social media and going on and just saying, you know, whatever is on the top of their head. And I think Valerie said, you know, that's that's authentic in the moment, but not to the person. And so, you know, there's a fine line there that we need to balance.

00;17;54;23 - 00;18;15;28

Dr. Foster Mobley

One of the one of the guests, I hope is in season two is a gentleman named Dan Doty. And Dan and I talked this is early on, and we were just kind of discovering this together. But he coined the phrase kind of layers of authenticity. And I really like that because I can be honest, but not completely disclose of at a variety of different levels.

00;18;16;00 - 00;18;37;16

Dr. Foster Mobley

And his thesis, he hadn't thought about it this way before, but his thesis is if we think authenticity is only at the deepest, darkest level. Oh gee, I was potty trained when I was six as a child. It took me a long time and I like who needs to know that, right? That's but layers of authenticity that says, you know, I still struggle with close relationships with with very strong people.

00;18;37;16 - 00;18;53;00

Dr. Foster Mobley

And that's what I'm working on. Like, that's deep, but it's not stuff. The other so Layers of Authenticity is a really interesting idea that I hope we can, we can share in the next season of stepwise.

00;18;53;03 - 00;19;14;29

Jana Devan

One layer of authenticity is, you know, trying to balance your vulnerability in leadership. And I'm curious if there's a moment in your life where being vulnerable strengthened your leadership or deepened a relationship. And how that aligns with the, you know, authenticity. We're talking about?

00;19;15;02 - 00;19;39;26

Dr. Foster Mobley

Yeah, almost always I'll just say that almost always, it's a phrase that Byron Katie is is almost always the first time. I remember I was 28 years old, I was doing some I was taking a class or something at the Forum Corporation, in Boston. Corporate, Boston, Massachusetts. Wonderful organization. I think it still exists, but in different forms now.

00;19;39;28 - 00;20;11;22

Dr. Foster Mobley

I met some life changing friends and colleagues there. I was in a class learning something as 28, maybe 29 years old. I had always been on top of the world. And as an Enneagram three, my image and, you know, showing up strongly and properly was always a big deal. And I got news that my father was in the hospital and, so we get ready to start the then that day that it was day two of a three day thing, and we all did a kind of a check in, how are you doing?

00;20;11;25 - 00;20;30;06

Dr. Foster Mobley

And for the first time in my life, I let myself be candid with other people like that in a business setting. I said, I'm not well, I'm not doing well. And there's part of me that wants to go home and, you know, like, I'm not sure what I could do there, but just I can't think about staying, you know, my father is ill.

00;20;30;09 - 00;20;50;17

Dr. Foster Mobley

I'm worried. And to the person it was like, please go, please go. Take care of like. And so, I didn't know that you could do that. I honestly did not know that you could be honest in a work setting and not honest, like, gee, I like the way you did that or I didn't don't like the way you did that.

00;20;50;17 - 00;21;08;20

Dr. Foster Mobley

It was, I am hurting. There's something going on in my personal life right now that's keeping me from being my best, and it's compromising my participation here. And they helped me come to a decision that I probably wouldn't have come to otherwise had I not been to this. This, that candid and vulnerable and raw with people so and so.

00;21;08;27 - 00;21;26;22

Dr. Foster Mobley

That was 27. And, I continued to get hit over the side of the head all the time. That reminds me that just candor, vulnerability is stuff is the is the way to go. I've got a decision I'm making right now that. Oh, my God, I hate conflict like that, but I know I need to do it.

00;21;26;24 - 00;21;41;23

Dr. Foster Mobley

And, but it's that reminder of, you know, be yourself, be truthful. Come from a compassionate place, but speak your truth is the way to go. So yes, it's only almost all.

00;21;41;26 - 00;22;14;02

Jana Devan

You can't turn off being human. And I think a lot of us who went to business school and, you know, learned to kind of deal in this very proper way, think, oh, I shut this human off, and now I just go to work. And so experiencing that at 2728, that's seems like a really great time to get that message early in the career so that you can then be vulnerable the rest of your career.

00;22;14;03 - 00;22;36;17

Dr. Foster Mobley

There's a phrase that that we're use, I'm using these days, I deal with in the book, and it's the phrase that, those younger than me use very commonly, which is and they're not wrong. So generations several layers below or above, maybe above me, you know, younger than me, don't have that same problem of vulnerability in the workplace.

00;22;36;17 - 00;22;59;01

Dr. Foster Mobley

I don't have the same problem with, hey, you know, my dog got sick and ate something bad, but, you know, not feeling it like there are levels and limits to that. On the other hand, it's for somebody like me for whom responsibility in my generation and my work is everything to to put my personal needs up is a hard thing.

00;22;59;03 - 00;23;17;05

Dr. Foster Mobley

Are they wrong? Are younger generations wrong to make more of their needs known and out loud? I don't think they're wrong. I just don't think they're wrong now how we deal with it, it's a whole different issue. But I don't think they're wrong to say, you know what? I'm hurting today. I need some help. I need some support from my team.

00;23;17;05 - 00;23;32;07

Dr. Foster Mobley

So this notion about today's workforce is are bringing their fuller sense of their humanity into the workplace. And it's up to the it's up to all of us to kind of figure that puzzle out. I think that's right. It's because they're not wrong.

00;23;32;13 - 00;23;57;20

Jana Devan

Yeah, I agree, I think it's been a much healthier workplace in the past five years than early in my career, at least in what I've experienced. So I'm very grateful for it. Yeah. People who, you know, led that charge. You've worked with so many remarkable people in coaching. We got to hear from them this season and I'm sure we'll hear from more.

00;23;57;20 - 00;24;02;14

Jana Devan

How does that influence you and how you lead?

00;24;02;17 - 00;24;40;22

Dr. Foster Mobley

I get paid to listen and to learn to synthesize and to share ideas and models, some of which come from the people that I'm already working for. So, for example, with a hospital CEO like Paul Viviano, I've learned so much from him about high performance and about humanity, the respect, the dignity, the candor, the approachability that he offers, all while coaching a high performance organization that I can learn from that.

00;24;40;22 - 00;25;10;20

Dr. Foster Mobley

And I can take examples like that one into my coaching work with others, and it also into my leading. You know, leadership is such a dynamic thing, and it's such a social enterprise that it's not something we can pick up a book and read and go, okay, I got this leadership stuff. Even though when I wrote my first one, I mentioned, I think in the introduction that were 277,000 books at the time on leadership, like, we can't pick up a book and learn about the dynamic social interaction between people.

00;25;10;22 - 00;25;36;07

Dr. Foster Mobley

That's something that happens over time. But and, and a lot of it comes from what we learn in working with other people. So has Paul had a huge influence on my life and leadership? Absolutely. As Joe Melo had interviewed like Kemp Theory, like those people Valerie Kondos have, they had a huge impact on how I think about and lead other people, without question, just too numerous to mention?

00;25;36;09 - 00;26;01;27

Jana Devan

Yeah. And I really hope people who listen to this interview will go back because, you know, all of these interviews have taught me so much. It really has been a masterclass for me. And so I just think, you know, hearing you and how you interact with people and the people that you've coached or are in your network, it's just so fascinating and really something that is special.

00;26;01;27 - 00;26;20;05

Dr. Foster Mobley

Yeah. The one common theme, Gina, that they have is that they're no bullshit people. They these people are legit cream of the crop. They've done their work, they've taken their lumps, they've healed their scars, they've done whatever, and they've created exceptional performance.

00;26;20;08 - 00;26;48;00

Jana Devan

I wanted to ask about a little bit more about mental health. You know, there's a question here that the interplay between leadership and mental health was brought up a lot. And I know we've already touched on this a little bit, but more on the like, burnout side of things and having a resilience through these times. Like you're you talks about October 7th and the pandemic and all of these things happening right now.

00;26;48;00 - 00;27;03;13

Jana Devan

There's discourse about health care, you know, in our country. And so I'm just curious, how can leaders prioritize well-being without guilt during these times?

00;27;03;15 - 00;27;31;17

Dr. Foster Mobley

One of our hopefully season two guest, Julie Kennedy, points to research in our interview about the levels of dissatisfaction and burnout among CEOs and C-suite people. So this is not just an organizational phenomenon. It's a leadership phenomenon as well. When you think about a leader's job is to navigate this collision between all these human forces and business disruption and global technology interruption in digital world.

00;27;31;17 - 00;27;51;04

Dr. Foster Mobley

In 24 seven news cycles and all of it where you don't know when you go into work that day. If three seconds ago, something has come across the newsfeed that will upset every bit of rational planning that you have, like we're shutting down, we've got a global pandemic go home for the next year. You don't know. It's not stuff you can plan for.

00;27;51;04 - 00;28;16;15

Dr. Foster Mobley

So how does a leader navigate this time? The reality is that it is a very stress filled time in a very challenging one. For leaders, having some sort of self-care regimen is valuable. The idea of, a leader serving his or her organization by working 14, 15 hours a day, six days a week, 90 plus hours is no longer viable, and it's no longer sustainable.

00;28;16;17 - 00;28;37;21

Dr. Foster Mobley

Thankfully, the word sustainable is now landing in people. Like all you have to say is God. Great heroics, not sustainable. And I want to make sure that you get to a sustainable way in. So take whatever time you need, develop whatever kind of, you know, rubric you need for mornings or for exercise or for whatever. We are now recognizing the pressure on leaders.

00;28;37;23 - 00;29;06;10

Dr. Foster Mobley

We are, encouraging them much more actively to prioritize their own health and well-being. And, you know, enlightened organizations are really supporting that move. Our youngest, Maddie, works for Lululemon, and I have been very, very impressed. Now, granted, it's a fitness brand. I get it. But they really walk their talk and they encourage people to take time every day out of their paid hours to go to a fitness class.

00;29;06;13 - 00;29;31;03

Dr. Foster Mobley

They encourage people to like if they need to go take a walk, they take a walk if they need to, whatever it is. And this is a high performing organization. This isn't like come to Lululemon and get a participation ribbon. No, they're changing the world. I mean, they're kicking butt and they're doing it with healthy people. They're doing it in a more sustainable human way then that net people opt into that culture.

00;29;31;03 - 00;29;41;12

Dr. Foster Mobley

They want to be part of that culture. They want to give their all in their work hours to that culture and recognize giving all doesn't mean giving. They're giving up their lives. That's a big.

00;29;41;12 - 00;30;00;12

Jana Devan

Deal. I love hearing that about an organization, you know, really letting people take time to get away from their desk if they need it, when they need it. You know, if we are in allowing the distance sort of work, then I think that's essential in a office environment personally.

00;30;00;18 - 00;30;16;17

Dr. Foster Mobley

Yeah. And there's nothing soft about that. Janna I know Maddie, she's hard charging. She really wants to be pushed and challenged and she wants to work art and she wants to play hard. It's part of her ethos, but she wants to work hard. And if there's a presentation and the CEO's if she wants to be in that meeting, there's nothing soft about that.

00;30;16;17 - 00;30;37;14

Dr. Foster Mobley

But there are times when you just kind of need to fold everything on your desk and go for a walk on the beach or whatever you do, and, you know, kind of get your bearings back about, you know, equating caring for one's self and softness has to go away, just has to go away because it's not right. What we're talking about is sustainable performance over time.

00;30;37;16 - 00;30;49;20

Jana Devan

And as you reflect back on your career, is this the biggest shift you've seen in sort of corporate culture? Has this happened, you know, multiple times over your career?

00;30;49;22 - 00;31;15;24

Dr. Foster Mobley

You know, I started in my career in the 70s and while there was the human potential movement that grew out of the 60s and tea groups and all that kind of stuff that happened in the 80s that made participation more real and more available, quality circles and tea groups and stuff like that. At the end of the day, it was really all about business performance.

00;31;15;26 - 00;31;51;15

Dr. Foster Mobley

And so why am I talking in a group, a circle of people? It's to get ideas for improved performance. This is different. This is really different. This is honoring and acknowledging the humanity of each of us. And I'm guessing the pandemic had an effect. I'm guessing in the 24 news cycle. And social media have had huge effects. I'm guessing that kind of geopolitics and the kind of razor's edge, like we are so close to two that feed positively and negatively every day is having an effect.

00;31;51;17 - 00;32;17;20

Dr. Foster Mobley

The digital divide, you know, kind of our digital world with AI and transforming knowledge, what that mean? All of these things are having an effect. I've never seen anything like this. Now. I also grew up in the 60s. 60s were the time of social upheaval, political unrest, you know, some economic changes, geopolitics, war in Vietnam, dividing society, all that stuff, very social changes.

00;32;17;20 - 00;32;21;14

Dr. Foster Mobley

But I've not seen changes that affect this many people in the business world ever.

00;32;21;18 - 00;32;47;18

Jana Devan

So in your first book, one of my favorite quotes is the journey of a thousand steps starts with a rock in the shoe. It sounds like that's how we're starting this. This, you know, everyone's kind of trying to figure it all out. And, I think about that quote a lot because a lot of times when I'm beginning something, I'm like, okay, there's a pebble in my shoe, but I'm still going to make it.

00;32;47;20 - 00;32;47;29

Jana Devan

Yeah.

00;32;48;07 - 00;32;51;00

Dr. Foster Mobley

If the journey is worth it, you stay, stay at it.

00;32;51;02 - 00;32;51;29

Jana Devan

Yeah, yeah.

00;32;52;02 - 00;33;00;27

Dr. Foster Mobley

The other the other quote I like to kind of similar is if you look down and see the path laid out in front of you, just know that somebody else's path.

00;33;01;00 - 00;33;01;22

Jana Devan

Yeah.

00;33;01;24 - 00;33;03;13

Dr. Foster Mobley

Because you got to figure your own out.

00;33;03;15 - 00;33;23;15

Jana Devan

Well yeah. That's very good. So I know we're running out of time here. I just wanted to wrap up with two more questions. So first of all, you know, we're wrapping up season one. What's a lesson you learned from this series that you hope that listeners take away from this?

00;33;23;18 - 00;33;53;09

Dr. Foster Mobley

It's a personal one. The feedback I've gotten more than any other after these 11 episodes is that it feels very natural and very conversational, and most of them were very unscripted. So lesson number one is when you are, when you are relaxed, when you are present, some incredible conversations can happen. They look really easy, they feel really easy, but they get to levels of depth that you could implant for.

00;33;53;11 - 00;34;17;24

Dr. Foster Mobley

And isn't that a great way to live life? To enter into conversation, say, tell me. Give me your story. When you approach people with that kind of openness yourself, it's a very, very powerful thing. So that was lesson one for me. Lesson two is every single person on the planet has a story, every one of us. It may not be polished, it may not be always as thoughtful as something.

00;34;17;24 - 00;34;35;29

Dr. Foster Mobley

But we all have a story and we want to tell it. And so being the vehicle for people telling their stories is pretty fun. I so enjoyed that. I had no idea how much fun that would be. I think it was Aristotle that said something like that. You can never judge another man or person because you don't know what they've been through.

00;34;36;01 - 00;34;44;09

Dr. Foster Mobley

I don't, I don't, but I do know they all have a story, and by doing this gives them a chance to tell the story and in that way be seen. And it's a really cool deal.

00;34;44;11 - 00;34;57;28

Jana Devan

So you've asked every guest one question, which is, what have you been reading or listening to right now that we should know about? And I wanted to ask you that question because I know you're a voracious reader.

00;34;57;28 - 00;35;23;25

Dr. Foster Mobley

At the stage of my life, I find myself I'm interested in being intentional about the next phase of my life, let's say quarter four and a basketball game. I do realize that I've had some preconceptions about aging that are probably not accurate. And so I'm reading a book called The Inner Work of Aging by Connie's Wake, who's a PhD psychologist and also union psychologist.

00;35;23;27 - 00;35;44;08

Dr. Foster Mobley

It's fabulous. It really talks about the intentionality of of using this time to develop a deeper relationship with your life by looking at some of the things that didn't work before. And from a union point of view, she called shadow. So that's one, another book I'm reading. The second book I'm reading, actually, is a book by the theologian Richard Rau.

00;35;44;08 - 00;36;02;12

Dr. Foster Mobley

Roe are called Falling Upwards in the same kind of deal it is. We planned very intentionally the first half of our lives that are really identity and ego based, right? We do it. We make money, we get kudos. We like all that stuff. Ego based. What about the second half of your life? Do we plan any for it?

00;36;02;12 - 00;36;21;21

Dr. Foster Mobley

As our identity shifts and that our ego needs are much less? Which is true, our egos not driving the bus nearly as much as it as it had been. So now what? And so I'm actually working with one of my coaching clients on kind of how do you plan the next phase. So those two very personally impactful, wonderful books.

00;36;21;27 - 00;36;41;28

Dr. Foster Mobley

The thing I'm listening to also the Peter of is the Drive podcast, and he had one on Ask Me Anything about personal health and nutrition. The past two years have been filling my brain with podcasts, which is wonderful. There's so much great stuff out there. So that's what I'm listening to and that's what I'm reading right now.

00;36;42;00 - 00;36;59;03

Jana Devan

We are so lucky to live in this world of information. Sometimes it feels like too much, but then sometimes I'm like, we are in a really great spot to get to have this at our fingertips. And so I'm glad that you have those resources on your journey. Yeah.

00;36;59;06 - 00;37;00;16

Dr. Foster Mobley

Yeah. It's wonderful.

00;37;00;22 - 00;37;07;08

Jana Devan

Well, thank you for talking to me today. That is all. Unless you want to add on anything.

00;37;07;08 - 00;37;41;25

Dr. Foster Mobley

I'd love to find out from people what most resonated with to them. Out of this season's guests, they were all similar, but very different from a Val Kondos to a Paul Viviano to a Joe Mello and Kent Thiry to Jen Fisher or Erin Rocchio. Like there's so much. Again, the common theme for me is that these are all people that have done their work and really done it in a very human centric way, but they're all very different, and I'd love to find out from people, you know, what they liked, what they resonated with, what they want to hear more of, who they want to hear more of.

00;37;41;27 - 00;37;44;13

Dr. Foster Mobley

That would be insanely helpful for me.

00;37;44;15 - 00;37;47;10

Jana Devan

Yeah. That's your call to action listeners.

00;37;47;12 - 00;38;08;01

Dr. Foster Mobley

For a deeper exploration of your own journey, you can find tools, stories, and reflection questions in my book Leadership Rethinking the True Path to Great Leading, or by following me on Social media. I'm on LinkedIn and Instagram as Foster Mobley. Until next time, step wise.

00;38;08;03 - 00;38;37;08

Jana Devan

Thank you for listening to Step Wise. Stepwise is brought to you by Doctor Foster Mobley, edited and promoted by Zettist. You can listen to more episodes wherever you stream podcasts. Find out more at fostermobleymt.com or follow us on social media at Foster Mobley. That's f-o-s-t-e-r-m-o-b-l-e-y. We look forward to having an inspiring conversation with you soon.